• fishos@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    Roundabouts would like a word. Properly designed ones don’t need to dramatically lower speeds and are more efficient. And can easily be made pedestrian friendly. It doesn’t have to be either or.

    • LibertyLizard@slrpnk.netOP
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      1 year ago

      Can they though? What does a pedestrian friendly roundabout look like? The ones I’ve seen seem outright hostile.

      I tried to find data but it doesn’t seem well studied. Since standard road design is so horrifically unsafe, unless it is substantially better it does not seem worth redesigning the intersection. I’d rather see that money go into something that has a proven benefit.

      Further reading: https://streets.mn/2017/11/17/are-roundabouts-safer-for-pedestrians/

        • Hagdos@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          Crosswalk bridges are pretty hostile to pedestrians. They need to be at least 4 meters/12 ft high, to accommodate standard lorries. Nobody likes climbing high stairs on every crossing. Even worse for wheelchair users.

          • fishos@lemmy.world
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            1 year ago

            If only we’d invented some sort of sloped surface. Maybe call it a “ramp”?

            • Hagdos@lemmy.world
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              1 year ago

              Scaling a 4 meter high ramps on every intersection sounds like a fucking nightmare

              • fishos@lemmy.world
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                1 year ago

                Yes, because no one anywhere has ever built a ramp that made sense.

                You’re intentionally being obtuse.

                • Hagdos@lemmy.world
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                  1 year ago

                  It doesn’t matter how much sense your ramp makes, it still needs enough height to allow trucks to pass under it. That’s a lot of height to gain. Any sensible ramp would be very long and take up a lot of space, and be very impractical to have to scale at every intersection.

      • deranger@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        It does lower speeds, you can’t just fly through a roundabout even if you’re going straight through. You can easily blast through a regular intersection at 100mph if you want.

        They have higher throughput though, so it’s “faster” in that sense. Lower peak speeds, higher average speeds (as you’re not stopped for a long time).

      • Ooops@kbin.social
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        1 year ago

        That’s the point of a roundabout. It lowers speed at the crossing while also increasing throughput compared to a regular crossing.

        So you can indeed lower speed at a crossing area while not lowering the speed of traffic overall, just by eliminating the waiting times.

          • Not_mikey@lemmy.world
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            1 year ago

            That’s only if you are crossing through a roundabout, which I’ve never seen for pedestrians. Pedestrians have to walk around the roundabout as well, crossing the two way streets that leads up to it and still having to look both ways for cars leaving and entering the roundabout. This is usually helped by a median but a regular intersection can have a median as well to accomplish the same thing. These medians will also usually create a slip though like the author says in the video, which allows cars to take right turns at speed, if the roundabout is empty, without checking for the crosswalk they’re turning into.

    • themusicman@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      Roundabouts require drivers to concentrate on multiple incoming streams of traffic to find a gap. Their attention is already divided, and they are far more likely to miss a pedestrian than at a regular intersection.

      • TaTTe@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        In roundabouts you only need to look in one direction of incoming cars. In a regular 4-way intersection you have to look in three directions. Your comment makes no sense to me.

      • snugglesthefalse@sh.itjust.works
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        1 year ago

        You mainly need to be looking right (flipped for anyone who doesn’t drive on the left) pretty much all the roundabouts here that regularly have pedestrians will have triggered traffic lights or the pedestrian crossing at least a car length before the roundabout starts so if you’re entering a roundabout you’re almost always in front of where people will cross if they’re not just being dumb. Once you’re used to roundabouts they’re pretty formulaic and the biggest problem (for me anyway) on an unfamiliar roundabout is knowing which lane to be in, not the traffic already on the roundabout.

  • Lord Wiggle@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    I live I nthe Netherlands. The Dutch road system has a very good reputation. And I agree, I love our infrastructure. I hope it is an example for the rest of the world.

    When I started driving myself, I loved to drive fast on the highway. I arrived supper annoyed at my destination as I had to evade near exidents ndue to people texting or just not paying attention. When I started to drive slow, making sure I wasn’t blocking others, I arrived calm and only 10min later then when I was speeding all the time. Also, most traffic jams happen because eof speeding people. They break more, which causes jams. In a traffic jam, try to maintain a constant speed, while barely breaking, keeping a lot of room in front of you. This helps solve traffic jams, of everyone would do this.

    • NarrativeBear@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      Same experience as you, when you drive slow and calm you find you arrive more calm and relaxed. Less traffic as well and most times there is the added benefit of not being stuck at the next red as it turns green before you get there.

  • neuropean@kbin.social
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    1 year ago

    I mean it’s pretty obvious from the headline, but the goal is to compromise if you’re to have any meaningful volume of transportation.

    • LibertyLizard@slrpnk.netOP
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      1 year ago

      We’ve already compromised too much by allowing cars in cities at all. If you are going to drive around innocent bystanders it needs to be done in a safe manner. Saving a minute on your commute is insignificant compared to a life.

    • Ebby@lemmy.ssba.com
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      1 year ago

      I do like the Las Vegas approach where pedestrians have a completely separate infrastructure. Its very easy to get around and i find vehicle traffic is fairly efficient for that sized city.

        • Ebby@lemmy.ssba.com
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          1 year ago

          There are sections of permanent elevated walkways and a network of bridges completely separating pedestrian and vehicle traffic. Just walk over the streets, no waiting for lights. Its pretty cool.

          • LibertyLizard@slrpnk.netOP
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            1 year ago

            Oh wow interesting. If I ever go I’ll have to take a look. Sounds expensive but if it works it works I guess.

  • AA5B@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    What’s your definition notion of speed? This one major street in my town was restricted from two lanes down to one through lane with turn lanes. They also reduced the speed limit and adjusted traffic lights.

    Result: much safer AND you reliably get through in less time. No stop and go, no weaving or merging, just slow and steady winning the race

  • Treczoks@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    Just wait until the bike crowd learns that this holds true in a bikers and pedestrian only situation.

    • LibertyLizard@slrpnk.netOP
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      1 year ago

      It is true that speed is more dangerous but how much more? Hopefully once we’ve dismantled most car infrastructure we can have separate travel lanes for bikes and pedestrians but right now I’m comfortable sharing. Bicycle collisions just aren’t very dangerous compared to car collisions.

      • Treczoks@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        Tell that to the relatives of that grandma who was run over and killed by a speeding biker in a pedestrian zone two weeks ago. He drove off when he saw her down and is still at large.

          • Treczoks@lemmy.world
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            1 year ago

            I agree with you that for deaths, this is nowhere close. But the relationship is there. You complain about the cars, but most bikers I see behave as badly to pedestrians as bikers claim about cars. They just don’t recognize that their behavior is as bad.