I just don’t think most / any connectors are going to be compatible with modern ddr speeds. Even doing the layout on these smd pads takes a lot of work to make it right. You’d be taking a major speed downgrade which would limit your performance way more than this ram amount upgrade overcomes.
Quick Edit: storage is another beast entirely where I agree with you completely. Looks like steam deck you can upgrade the ssd and it’s at least way easier than this. Comparable to a laptop.
Yeah I thought about this some more. I totally forgot that even on my PC I installed ram through a connector. So there is a capability, but my experience is just more in an embedded electronics place where it really isn’t standard just to save space and cost. We also theoretically know the requirements going in so leaving space to upgrade isn’t required like it is for a generic platform like a PC or steamdeck. I don’t think the typical DIMM connectors would work with the form factor, but a different connector could maybe do it. There could also possibly be reliability concerns with ram in a handheld around whatever movement the connector, is expected to deal with, but that couldn’t be overcome. So yeah it’s for sure possible but it would take some work.
I feel like a solution similar to m.2 could work, holding the module in place with a screw. I dont think the m.2 connector would suffice as it only has 67 pins and DIMMs have I think 288 pins, so that’s quite a difference. I do think SODIMM has less pins, but not much less, definitely not to the tune of less than a quarter as many.
Having recently looked inside my steam deck to upgrade the storage, I honestly think they would have had room for at least one SODIMM slot, but the tradeoff is increased thermals, more power draw, and probably some design constraints around the pcb leads possibly leading to increased overhead or latency. I agree that a new form factor would be best to address these issues. It would be cool if something similar to the SXM socket came out, having a pad of pins so you can increase the amount of pins while taking up the same space.
Yeah, we’d need some sort of modular RAM size that’s small. No idea why we have 2TB of lightning fast storage and it’s the size of a postage stamp, but the RAM sticks are still more or less the same clunky sizes we had 30 years ago.
I guess its because SSD storage wasn’t an option back then and the interface is newer. But since soldered RAM is more of a rilule these days we do need something new.
It’s because ram is even faster with lower latency.
Pcie4.0x4 nvme is 40Gbps (I presume you mean pcie4.0 which is the newest and greatest over pcie3.0).
And that’s if it can actually sustain that level of read/write consistently, and isn’t just dumping data into a buffer.
DDR3 1333mhz is 80Gbps (which is 15 years old).
DDR4 2133 is 136Gbps.
These are just rough numbers. Actual throughput is going to depend on number of channels, mobo, CPU etc.
I’d wager the same kind of people screaming “it should have been socketed” are the same people who would scream “why the fuck did they make this thing so thick?!”
The chips themselves are the most expensive parts usually, much more than a socket and additional daughterboard. And if they were all modular you can reuse those chips for other devices!
Also, even back in the chunky early 2000s IBM Thinkpad days I never really minded the size or weight, that’s just my own opinion though.
![[MOD] SteamDeck upgrade to 32gb of ram](https://lemmy.ml/pictrs/image/4e4b508f-e6cf-45b3-b3cc-ff897cada107.jpeg){kind=link}
Can we go back to the good old days where our devices had openings for RAM and storage upgrades please?
Especially for things like this.
Since when did small handheld devices have openings for RAM and storage upgrades?
Laptops always used to. Even most of those don’t any more.
Apple are certainly the worst offender here (want 2TB storage in your iPad Pro, that’ll be an extra £1250 please), but they’re not alone.
Laptops aren’t handhelds, they’re laptops.
Did I say handhelds?
The person you replied to said “small handheld devices”, and I don’t think most people would put laptops in that category
I just don’t think most / any connectors are going to be compatible with modern ddr speeds. Even doing the layout on these smd pads takes a lot of work to make it right. You’d be taking a major speed downgrade which would limit your performance way more than this ram amount upgrade overcomes.
Quick Edit: storage is another beast entirely where I agree with you completely. Looks like steam deck you can upgrade the ssd and it’s at least way easier than this. Comparable to a laptop.
Wouldn’t be a speed downgrade for the steamdeck, for future generarions I would agree. I think thickness is the primary factor.
Yeah I thought about this some more. I totally forgot that even on my PC I installed ram through a connector. So there is a capability, but my experience is just more in an embedded electronics place where it really isn’t standard just to save space and cost. We also theoretically know the requirements going in so leaving space to upgrade isn’t required like it is for a generic platform like a PC or steamdeck. I don’t think the typical DIMM connectors would work with the form factor, but a different connector could maybe do it. There could also possibly be reliability concerns with ram in a handheld around whatever movement the connector, is expected to deal with, but that couldn’t be overcome. So yeah it’s for sure possible but it would take some work.
I feel like a solution similar to m.2 could work, holding the module in place with a screw. I dont think the m.2 connector would suffice as it only has 67 pins and DIMMs have I think 288 pins, so that’s quite a difference. I do think SODIMM has less pins, but not much less, definitely not to the tune of less than a quarter as many.
Having recently looked inside my steam deck to upgrade the storage, I honestly think they would have had room for at least one SODIMM slot, but the tradeoff is increased thermals, more power draw, and probably some design constraints around the pcb leads possibly leading to increased overhead or latency. I agree that a new form factor would be best to address these issues. It would be cool if something similar to the SXM socket came out, having a pad of pins so you can increase the amount of pins while taking up the same space.
Apple Silicon has entered the chat.
“No.”
I’d love a standardized tiny socket like the MMC modules or something alike. A DIMM socket would be far too large.
Even though upgrading RAM in a steam deck wouldn’t be that useful it increases the ability to repair it.
Yeah, we’d need some sort of modular RAM size that’s small. No idea why we have 2TB of lightning fast storage and it’s the size of a postage stamp, but the RAM sticks are still more or less the same clunky sizes we had 30 years ago.
I guess its because SSD storage wasn’t an option back then and the interface is newer. But since soldered RAM is more of a rilule these days we do need something new.
It’s because ram is even faster with lower latency.
Pcie4.0x4 nvme is 40Gbps (I presume you mean pcie4.0 which is the newest and greatest over pcie3.0).
And that’s if it can actually sustain that level of read/write consistently, and isn’t just dumping data into a buffer.
DDR3 1333mhz is 80Gbps (which is 15 years old).
DDR4 2133 is 136Gbps.
These are just rough numbers. Actual throughput is going to depend on number of channels, mobo, CPU etc.
Sure, if you want your device to be half an inch thicker, and more expensive.
Steam deck is already a brick, would anyone notice?
I’d wager the same kind of people screaming “it should have been socketed” are the same people who would scream “why the fuck did they make this thing so thick?!”
The chips themselves are the most expensive parts usually, much more than a socket and additional daughterboard. And if they were all modular you can reuse those chips for other devices!
Also, even back in the chunky early 2000s IBM Thinkpad days I never really minded the size or weight, that’s just my own opinion though.
last i checked a thinkpad wasnt a handheld device, either.